| Archive for NEEPS North East Eco-friendly People's Site |
| wildgarlic |
Help with drainsWhat to do? Drains are backing up everywhere and D isn't here to help - I've tried poking a long piece of alkathene pipe down an access point (for want of other word) but that hasn't helped. Really don't know what to do. Will it cost an arm and a leg to call someone out?Suggestions please - on top of that the gander keeps escaping and the goat keeps jumping the fence and eating the fruit trees! AAARRGH!!!! |
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| Thrawnquine |
I've had really unpleasant smelling drains in my bathroom this past week and have poured down neat bleach, plus some other type of bathroom cleaner, plus a kettle of boiling water, then finally some soda crystals and more boiling water. It seems to have done the trick, but it may be your problem is more with a septic tank drainage system and I know when we had one we were always warned not to use any detergent. How else were we supposed to do our laundry? | ||
| zombiecazz |
I remember cleaning a drain with some stiff rubber pipe with a nail hammer through it so it was sticking out both sides.
This helped to dislodge the great big ball of hair stopping the drain working |
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| wildgarlic |
just looked at the septic tank and it's virtually empty and dry - must be a fairly hefty blockage somewhere. Time for the professionals methinks. | ||
| Smooth Hound |
do you have any covers anywhere to inspect, or drain rod entry points anywhere | ||
| wildgarlic |
looked at all I can find - we've had problems before and I don't know whether D really sorted it properly back then - not a criticism but it did start having problems again pretty much straight away. | ||
| Smooth Hound |
all you can do is to push a length of alcathene down, the nail through is a good idea, if you like ill bring a length over tomorrow, ill come a bit early, you may need it done sooner though, can you think of anything particular thats gone down there recently, like fat or something | ||
| wildgarlic |
It could be fat - D is always doing it. I think I will put a blooming big notice up at the sink to warn against it. Grrrrr.
Phoned septic tank man but they only empty them - waiting for a friend who is trying to get in touch with her hubby so he can take a look. |
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| wildgarlic |
meant to say - thanks for the nail idea ZC. I'll give that a try too. Lovely work eh. | ||
| misteralz |
In which case, you want to try emptying as much of the pipe as possible before the blockage, then pouring some boiling water down a tube which can't go any further - if that makes sense? |
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| Smooth Hound |
so have you got some alkathene then, or shall i bring some over tomorrow, if it is fat, youll need boiling water too , if you pour it down the drain and rod it at the same time, but itll need to be alot of hot water | ||
| wildgarlic |
Thanks Misteralz - oh joy  Will try again after lunch. Friend's hubby is coming to look later too.
Smooth - I do have some pipe but I've no idea whether it's long enough. (a common complaint I think  )
I've tried to contact the bloke that installed it too in case he knows of any rodding points that I've missed along the way. I can't see any other than those right next to the house and the drains extend a fair way down the drive after that. |
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| Smooth Hound |
ive got hold of some drain rods, which ill bring with me tomorrow, just in case , can use your hose if you have one, to push down as far as it will go and put it on a hot tap, as mr alz says, and between the 2 that should clear it, proffesionals will charge a fair bit, and cant do much more anyway, unless they start poking cameras down itm in which case the charge is high  but get what info you can from the bloke who did the drains, it will be useful
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| wildgarlic |
ok - well I've managed to clear the biggest bit. Can't believe it but someone had left the cover to the drain on the window sill!!! There was a plastic plant bag down there causing the biggest blockage so I fished that out - it was jammed fairly hard. Still some crap down there and would be very grateful for a shot of the drain rods tomorrow Smooth if you don't mind.
Anyway - biggest panic is over, thanks for all suggestions. |
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| Smooth Hound |
 its a good job you didnt get the proffesionals out, youd have felt a right nana,
sounds like that was the main problem though, ill bring them over anyway, it wont take 10 minutes to do, hopefully
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| Smooth Hound |
as a matter of interest talking about oil and fat down the drains,
there apparently is talk of a ban,  or something anyway about the use of oil etc , because of people putting it down the drain,
although the talking about the main sewage, apparently its blocking things up
alyhough i would imagine its more to do with the fuel crisis myself , as the sewage roblems been going on for yrs, i remember watching something on it some 10 yrs or more ago |
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| Sassinak |
Yes but most problems with the main sewers are probably getting worse as more houses use low flush toilets. Things won't be getting diluted as much now. | ||
| Julie |
The worst culprit for stopping septic tank systems working is fat. I can't help wondering if every time this happens it only gets partially cleared WG. It's happenning too often to be a fresh problem every time.
If it was my drain, once I had some flow going, I would put something a bit more caustic than hot water down it to shift everything once and for all and then get the tank emptied to get rid of it all and start afresh. The problem with hot water is it doesn't stay boiling and may just emulsify the fat into a skin on the surface of the tank, causing other parts of the system to slow or stop working. You could end up having to clear out the soakaways or herringbone systems instead (or whatever you have ) because your excess isn't draining away. I had a conversation with the boss at Rhinds last time I was there. They use some chemical that completely breaks down the fat so it can be washed into the sewer. He gets such a lot of grief from head office for using three times more than all their other places, but that's why it doesn't stink there. Anyway, I'm rambling, my point is, if you can find out what they use, it (or something similar) might clear the system once and for all. I shouldn't really say this but, it might cure D from putting fat down the drain if he gets a nice big bill from a pressure hosing company 
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| Maidenstone |
We've had problems before - the blockage was in the drain just before the septic tank. We've got an inspection lid about 4 foot before the septic tank and stuff was bubbling up through that, so OH poked through from inspection area to septic tank and that cleared it. Had problems years ago when we bought a very fat lamb for the freezer and fat blocked the drain from the washing up water. Have learnt to skim off as much fat as possible before cleaning roasting tins etc.
Our septic tank went for 12 years before needing emptying, but now needs it every few years of so. Once you start messing about with it the delicate balance is ruined and you are morel likely to have problems. The last time it was emptied the driver asked if he could park up at our place so he and his mate could have their lunch. I asked if they would like to come in and wash their hands, and he said "Nah, we never bother!" !!! He probably has fantastic immunity to bugs! |
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| Maidenstone |
One of the worst things for septic tanks is bleach - it kills of the bugs that 'eat' stuff in the tank. Also cotton buds can clump together and cause blockages, and also 'female products'. They say never put anything down the loo that you haven't eaten first, plus loo paper. Loos don't need any more cleaning than a good scrub round with some Cif and some ordinary household cleaner - after all, as soon as someone uses the loo all that disinfecting is undone. Just keep the loo clean and the bugs have no where to stick. | ||
| wildgarlic |
Oh Damn and blast and lots of words that I can't say on this forum. It's worse than ever today and I can't shift it. We've got a houseful of people tonight too - hope they don't want to use the loo much.
:-( I feel like crying. |
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| IainC |
I guess that the rods didn't help too much last time then...
I'd have said that if you are having issues having rodded out the pipes, then it's more than likely an issue with the outflow/soakaway that's the problem. |
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| Maidenstone |
We also had problems with our soakaway and were advised to call "Black Jock" - I think he lives in Wartle near Inverurie. Everyone seems to know him. He would soon sort it out. | ||
| Welly |
I think you need to take a step back a bit, WG. One of your earliest observations was:
If the tank is dry, ie the level of the crust is below the tank inflow and outflow, then the problem must surely be between the house and the tank. Don't mistake the dryness of the surface for a dry tank - below that crust is the liquid effluent, and below that, a layer of sludge. What you are looking for is for the inlet to be clear. If you are able to use water in the house, and it drains away down the plug hole, then presumably some water is getting through. It might not be a complete blockage. You could test this by filling a sink with water, pulling out the plug, and then peeking into the inspection chamber or the tank itself to see if the water is getting through. Don't expect it to come rushing out immediately or in a torrent, even if the drain is clear - drain pipes are very shallow, so the water and 'stuff' moves very slowly. If the water drains from the sink very slowly, and you hear a gurgling from the plug hole for a while afterwards (you might also hear it from the bath and basin plug holes at the same time), then there may be a partial blockage causing an air lock. Rodding will usually work, followed by a bathful of water to really get things moving, regardless of the cause of the blockage. I presume it isn't just the kitchen sink that exhibits a problem? Could it be that the sink drain pipe and trap are blocked, and that other drains (basin, bath, toilet, etc) are OK? Welly |
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| Smooth Hound |
the whole lots blocked as far as i understand welly, but i would say your right about it being between the house and tank, and not after the tank, that would be my guess anyway. | ||
| wildgarlic |
Sorry - only just seen this reply.
I think the problem is most definitely between the house and the tank - it's all the drains on one side of the house that are affected - not sure about the ones on the other side because they've not had much use since D has been away. Used the bathroom on that side of the house last day or so and no doubt it will block up eventually too. The drain hole and inspection outside the backdoor are filling up and stuff isn't getting away. I'll be rodding tomorrow once mum and L are away - poured some stuff down the drains today too but doesn't appear to have made a difference. I can see a couple of indentations in the ground along what I expect is the route to the septic tank - could that be an indication of a collapse in the drains? I could see the inlet to the septic tank a few feet above the crusty layer but haven't seen the outlet - will give it a better look tomorrow. I will check to see whether there is anything getting through tomorrow too. Really appreciate all the suggestions - thank you! |
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| Ali |
I was once told to put a dead rabbit (road kill) into the septic tank to encourage the bacteria the bleach kills. ?? if there is any truth in this. Never did try it | ||
| Maidenstone |
Our septic tank man said things like that don't do any good. Just don't use bleach. | ||
| wildgarlic |
thanks to the loan of the drain rods Smooth - I think the problem is now fixed. I delved down a few times with the rods and it seems to be flowing nicely now.
Still not sure on the way the septic tank works but the vent showed that water was moving through. What a relief - thanks for all the help folk. |
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| Smooth Hound |
yes i think its fine, im not certain of the way the inlets outlets etc work in the tanks, i only know about concrete pits as such. but it certainly seemed to be working well now,
a job well done, |
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| IainC |
The way I understand it, is that chucking a dead rabbit (or similar) into one helps the rotting down process get started, but it won't keep it working if you are filling the thing with harsh bleaches, etc. The whole point of those chemicals is to kill all bacteria (which you don't want to do in a septic tank). Even with the milder ones now, that's why people nowadays have to keep emptying tanks every so often, whereas before tanks were rarely (if ever?) emptied (as far as I'm aware). |
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| Welly |
I think concrete pits (we have one) and septic tanks are very much the same in principle (by septic tank, do you mean one of the modern plastic type things?). The inlet is slightly higher than the outlet, and each is a pipe with a kind of 't-piece' attached to the end with another short lengh of pipe pointing down into the 'stuff'. I think this is called a baffle. The baffle on the inlet stops anything coming into the tank from disturbing the 'stuff' too much. The baffle on the outlet ensures that what flows out comes only from the central belt of effluent - the bacterial fluid between the crust and the sludge. Gotta love this terminology! The inlet pipes are extremely shallow on the run from the house to the tank, because otherwise all the fluid runs away quickly leaving 'stuff' behind. Once this starts to happen, more 'stuff' just gets caught up, and then more, and so on until you have a blockage. The downside of the shallow pipes is that if there has been a slippage in the pipe, it wouldn't have to go far before it had a negative gradient. In other words, the run would be in the wrong direction, forming a 'trap' of standing water. This could be dicey, but is extremely unlikely I would think. I also think it unlikely that the drain has collapsed if you can rod it. Quite hard to push bits of squashed pipe and rubble through with rods I imagine. If it blocks again, you might be able to see what's causing it if you can actually see what the rod is pushing out (obviously this takes two people!), or you could throw hundreds of pounds away on a firm with a drain camera. Personally, I would opt for the former. I would also recommend that you invest £20 on a set of drain rods, or as many sets as are necessary to reach through the longest single run of pipe in your setup (ie, between inspection points). I have fours sets or rods for that very reason. Not cheap, but knowing I can clear a blockage at any time gives a peace of mind that's worth every penny! Glad everything's flowing though WG. Well done. Welly |
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| IainC |
Agreed... we bought enough rods to do ours as well (think it was two packs plus a pack of extra rods IIRC).
We had never had an issue with ours (or even needed it emptied) until we got new neighbours, then we seemed to be having no end of issues with it, but it was blocking up in the pipes that only we used (apart from a short part at the bottom that we shared). Was wondering if it was something that they were doing that was causing the issues, until we eventually found the culprit was a semi collapsed drain by the road side. It'd been damaged by the guy doing the road to another house, and I guess the removals truck for the other neighbours going, and the new ones arriving shifted it enough for it to start becoming an issue
Thankfully its all sorted out now, but it's worth checking your pipes every now and then and giving them a quick rod out, just to avoid it blocking up... nothing worse than HAVING to be out there doing it regardless of the weather, time of day, etc, when you could just do a quick clear out one afternoon/evening, the same as you do with a chimney. |
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| wildgarlic |
thanks again - I will definitely be investing in some rods. | ||
| Smooth Hound |
not bad 20 quid, how many rods do you get to a set. | ||
| wildgarlic |
Found one on Amazon with 10 rods for £15.44 delivered! http://www.amazon.co.uk/Silverline-273193-Drain-Rods/dp/B000LFXFGA | ||
| Smooth Hound |
thats really good 1.50 a rod, you cant beat that can you
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| Welly |
That's a good price for sure. I was basing mine on an email I got from Screwfix, so I'm glad you've found something cheaper.
You might want to take a look at www.toolstation.com. They have a set of 10 rods plus a screw and a plunger fitting for £16.31. Delivery is free for orders over £20, so with a few extra bits and pieces, you could easily make that. They also do a whole series of other attachments (inc a chimney brush) which might be useful. Welly |
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| Smooth Hound |
a chimney brush would be handy, i think id get one of those one drain end, and 2 sets, if i was going to get some, im not going to though, as my landlords got a set
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